timjyin wrote:

everything has an equal positive and negative aspect to it. it might be seen immediately. it might take x amount of days weeks years to reveal itself.

what we arent aware of could be described as "the unknown" or "god" or "universal law".

history shows us an evolution of ideas, spiritualism, concepts, beliefs, technology etc.

the balance of nature is not controlled by the human being

so the balance of the human will not be controlled by him/her either.

it is learned, slowly and painfully through many sacrifices and learning about positive and negative attitudes, behaviours, emotions and thought.

but the more aware and self aware we become the more in balance we will become..but never to perfection. thats left up to evolution.

positive can turn into negative and negative into positive over time.

Yin Yang.

what do you mean possitive and negative? what do you mean "perfection"? one must also balance; balance and imbalance. balance within balance within balance within balance within......



you get the idea right?

timjyin wrote:

i have no idea what is positive or negative

its not for me to judge in the great scheme of things



one could argue that murder is "negative"

our society recognizes it as so because it punishes murder..

but we have evolved to understand degrees of murder



when was the first "murder"?

how was it perceived as murder?

unlawful killing?



then that killling was also positive

because humans recognized that killing was possibly a negative thing

ie. (in my limited language).."not good", "sin", "evil", blah blah blah



perfection?

we all have an idea of perfection

because we understand imperfection

ie, pain, suffering,



balance



ever walked along a narrow wall as a kid

and thought "i got the hang of this"



you look down to see how you are doing

and you fall off

pain and suffering serve a purpose. yin and yan states that it should not be shyed away from but rather accepted and balanced with pleasure.


negative and positive are creations of human thought. pain isn't negative anymore then uglyness is negative. this is a superfecial limiting perspective that does not exist in metaphysics. ballance does not equal happyness. balance equals wisdom. with such wisdom one can reap happyness to a degree. but if one is wise then one simply lets happyness come, and does not chace it down.


perfection has no meaning. it is illusionary. we just are.


all emotions seem to keep us in internal yin/ external yan. basically to keep us alive and kickin. but in reality, life is absurd, and serves no purpose.

timjyin wrote:

quite a sweeping statement?



"life has no purpose"?



how would you know?



how would anyone know?



tim

there is no reason to assume it does. where did this purpose come from? who placed it there? under what athority? why?




purpose is purely a human concept. there is no reason to believe other wise. by grasping at such notions you only trick yourself into believing what you want to believe. life just is. that is taoism. that is yin and yan

timjyin wrote:

the one thing that bonds you and i together

regardless of our petty rationalisations of life (and the causes of many a war and death..)

is



none of us know the meaning of life.



or even death



i agree with absurd

but thats just the life journey of non understanding

one could say that know one knows anything. put then where would we be if we acted on this?

timjyin wrote:

" that is yin and yan "



------------------------------------



depends how you understand yin and yang





i dont subscribe to traditional thinking

it cant evolve



tim

non-duality can become duality? i beg to differ. if that is so it is contradicting to the intire yin and yan concept, and everything falls to peaces.

timjyin wrote:

Absurdistic Animus wrote:

timjyin wrote:

" that is yin and yan "



------------------------------------



depends how you understand yin and yang





i dont subscribe to traditional thinking

it cant evolve



tim

non-duality can become duality? i beg to differ. if that is so it is contradicting to the intire yin and yan concept, and everything falls to peaces.

not for me it doesnt

as i say i dont subscribe to traditional thinking

i have just used past concepts and developed them for myself



in the end my friend

it will just come down to simple belief



and i am incredibely limited in understanding

to convince you of its truth



tim

very well then. though i still hold that to do this is contradicting, but perhapes you are right. i will think on it rather then debate you in abstract philsophies (if such a thing can be done) if i may say you hold rather confusionist views on yin and yan. perhaps you should read some of confuciouses writing. if that is, you have not already.
-peace

Mike wrote:





Your way off and ungrateful. Perhaps you would rather there be nothing? Perfection has meaning. If things didn't happen exactly the way they did there would be no such thing as life. Perfection is balance. We have a sun that is exactly the type of sun you need to support life. The earth has every element and is perfectly balanced to support life... Water, gravity, tempiture, gases etc etc.. Look around everything is in balance and we are disrupting this balance.

we're disrupting the balance?

if evolution is true,

we were created by the balance.



besides,

if we disrupt the balance while we here,

and we end up killing ourselves (along with a large number of other species),

the equilibrium tendency of nature will soon be reached again.



evolution's effect is balance.

the intricacy of the world can be attributed to evolution the same way people attribute it to God.



'if things didn't happen exactly the way they did there would be no such thing as life'



consider this:

the universe could have existed for a VERY long time.

if there's any chance that what we have could have been created without god,

then time would eventually allow that chance.

it could have been a VERY long wait for our existence,

but that chance would have been taken eventually in the course of eternity.

it is being taken now.

Nothing is perfect. Nothing is static.



Everything is in a constant state of becoming.







Jeesh

{Mysteriosity} wrote:

Nothing is perfect. Nothing is static.



Everything is in a constant state of becoming.







Jeesh

is there a state of 'became'?

SHINDA SHIMA wrote:

{Mysteriosity} wrote:

Nothing is perfect. Nothing is static.



Everything is in a constant state of becoming.







Jeesh

is there a state of 'became'?

i'll expound on my question:



if something's becoming something,

then it must have a certain goal in mind.

what happens when it becomes what it was becoming?

and here's my answer,

to my own question:



by the time it is what it was becoming,

it will already want to become something else,

and so isn't complete yet.



the standards are always raised after the goal is met,

because humans measure everything relatively

I told you - nothing is static.



Everything is becoming (and I used this in the platonian sense). In essense, everything is changing, but this is the ontological universe we are talking about - not the multiverse, or the basis of all things 'real', the omniverse.

Mike wrote:

Absurdistic Animus wrote:

timjyin wrote:

i have no idea what is positive or negative

its not for me to judge in the great scheme of things



one could argue that murder is "negative"

our society recognizes it as so because it punishes murder..

but we have evolved to understand degrees of murder



when was the first "murder"?

how was it perceived as murder?

unlawful killing?



then that killling was also positive

because humans recognized that killing was possibly a negative thing

ie. (in my limited language).."not good", "sin", "evil", blah blah blah



perfection?

we all have an idea of perfection

because we understand imperfection

ie, pain, suffering,



balance



ever walked along a narrow wall as a kid

and thought "i got the hang of this"



you look down to see how you are doing

and you fall off

pain and suffering serve a purpose. yin and yan states that it should not be shyed away from but rather accepted and balanced with pleasure.



negative and positive are creations of human thought. pain isn't negative anymore then uglyness is negative. this is a superfecial limiting perspective that does not exist in metaphysics. ballance does not equal happyness. balance equals wisdom. with such wisdom one can reap happyness to a degree. but if one is wise then one simply lets happyness come, and does not chace it down.



perfection has no meaning. it is illusionary. we just are.



all emotions seem to keep us in internal yin/ external yan. basically to keep us alive and kickin. but in reality, life is absurd, and serves no purpose.

Your way off and ungrateful. Perhaps you would rather there be nothing? Perfection has meaning. If things didn't happen exactly the way they did there would be no such thing as life. Perfection is balance. We have a sun that is exactly the type of sun you need to support life. The earth has every element and is perfectly balanced to support life... Water, gravity, tempiture, gases etc etc.. Look around everything is in balance and we are disrupting this balance.

why thank you. you know me so well. i bow to your infanite wisdom. i doubt you even understood what it was we where talking about as i was speaking taoist to taoist. and more then likely using phrases you dont comprehend. you automaticaly assume absurd to mean negative. that is your failure. not mine.

timjyin wrote:

Absurdistic Animus wrote:

timjyin wrote:

Absurdistic Animus wrote:

timjyin wrote:

" that is yin and yan "



------------------------------------



depends how you understand yin and yang





i dont subscribe to traditional thinking

it cant evolve



tim

non-duality can become duality? i beg to differ. if that is so it is contradicting to the intire yin and yan concept, and everything falls to peaces.

not for me it doesnt

as i say i dont subscribe to traditional thinking

i have just used past concepts and developed them for myself



in the end my friend

it will just come down to simple belief



and i am incredibely limited in understanding

to convince you of its truth



tim

very well then. though i still hold that to do this is contradicting, but perhapes you are right. i will think on it rather then debate you in abstract philsophies (if such a thing can be done) if i may say you hold rather confusionist views on yin and yan. perhaps you should read some of confuciouses writing. if that is, you have not already.

-peace

i have to say that i find i am being condescended upon...

(not unusual with self named philosophers)



confusionist? interesting ...



"after confusion comes awareness"



i'd rather be confused

than ignorantly aware



"when i think i know

then i dont know

when i think i dont know

then i know"



tim

peace?

there's no such thing....

lol no i wasn't being condacending.lol sorry if it came off that way. not confusionist. confucious. my bad.